Abortion: An Argument for the Sane Citizen

Suppose we could all put aside the religion, the politics, and personal needs, on the subject of abortion. Instead, we looked on it from a logical and sane perspective. What would the argument look like?

If the life of a mother is threatened by the fetus, the mother has the right to self-defense. She therefore has the right to choose whether to defend her own life by ending the pregnancy early, or continuing the pregnancy. No person, institution, or agency can in anyway impeded the mother's choice in the matter of self-defense when the mother's life is threatened.

Ending the pregnancy early does not automatically mean aborting the fetus. It means simply that, ending the pregnancy early. If the pregnancy can be ended early without aborting the fetus then this is required by law, as all life is protected. If the mother chooses in this case to keep the child, then she may do so. If however, she chose not to keep the child, all parental rights and responsibilities would be removed from the mother and the child would be managed by the state until such time as it might be placed with a qualified family.

Further, a pregnancy can threaten the life of the mother by definition by more than physical means. For instance, in the case of rape, assuming rape can be legally determining, pregnancy may threaten the life of a mother by physiological means.

Determination of threat to life would be made by the mother's personal physician, and two additional medical doctors. The decision would be based solely on a set of predetermined criteria. If threat is determined, the choice of self-defense becomes the right solely of the mother.

Other than in those cases in which the fetus presents a determined threat to the life of the mother, abortion would be illegal.

Illegality of abortion under all but cases of self-defense is based on the premise that law should protect all life.

Mothers not having the right to abort a fetus except in cases of threat, would inevitably lead to mothers giving birth to unwanted children. Mothers in such situations would also be afforded clear unalienable rights to permanently free themselves of any obligations and rights to the unwanted child. Under such circumstances the child would be managed by the state until such time as it might be placed with a qualified family. Qualified families, it can easily be shown, are in abundant supply. In such situations, the mother would have given up all rights to even the knowledge of the child and would have no legal recourse to resend that decision. In essence, the mother would have traded the right to abort a fetus at will, with that of aborting parental rights at will. The results to the mother being largely similar, except in the matter of convenience.

To support this argument, again taking away all religious, political and personal needs, view abortion in a strictly logical light. Abortion becomes a simple matter of one person choosing to end the life of another person. This is illegal in all other areas of law. A person may not take the life of another simply because they choose to do so. The only exception being that of clear self-defense.

Abortion is no different. In all cases, except those of self-defense, a mother choosing to abort a fetus comes down to a simple choice...a choice of convenience. No matter how it is framed, or phrased, or stated, abortion is choice. Choosing to end the life of another is illegal. Therefore, choosing to abort is illegal.

The argument that an unborn fetus is not life cannot be accepted logically unless it can be proven. Sane society would accept that a fetus removed from the mother, which is viable, and survives into childhood would have proven itself to have been life as a fetus. Therefore, a fetus, which has been carried to a point where it might be considered viable medically, is to be considered life. Due to ever advancing capabilities in sustaining the life of premature birth situations, the determination in our argument as to the viability of, and therefore the life status of, a fetus would necessarily require regular review.

So given a legal structure where:

• no mother can be denied the right to self-defense against a threatening fetus
• a fetus determined medically viable is also determined to be a life
• life is protected by law
• a mother giving birth to an unwanted child has the unalienable rights to abort their parental rights

How can a sane citizen argue for, or against, abortion outside of the legal structure? Would not a sane person see the logical and clear moral necessity to uphold and support such a legal structure?

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UPDATE: This was reposted in the JustAThought group over on MySpace and it's been getting many comments. Check them out.

presidential hand puppets saluting abomination

in the end...
presidential hand puppets saluting abomination
storm troopers devouring religious doughnuts
adolescent veil revealing elemental abyss
obsidian sands extinguishing emerald time
...before the beginning


translucent eyes devour truth,
while obsidian tears rip reality's veil.
death reborn an abomination of light,
leads the thinker beyond the known.
sparks of tomorrow erase today,
fading color from the knower's eyes...a tear.

Found a little Gnosis...and I feel fine. ;)

Belief. I have belief, but what do I believe? That...I believe...is a very good question to which I've had more answers than questions.

I started out, as do most from the South, indoctrinated in Protestant based Christian teachings. I rejected that early on as completely contrary to the world around me. So I turned to science, some of which made sense, much of which seemed short sighted and overly restrictive. Then I turned to philosophy...I fell asleep nearly smothered by the book on my face. Eventually, I returned to a more liberated spirituality. A more open and investigative spirituality. I suppose I became a seeker of sorts. Through chance encounters and very deliberate experience, I found some things that worked, some that made sense, but generally I found a group of people left very much wanting. I've spent much of the last few years lingering on the outer boundaries of this community left wanting, but that may have finally changed.

I seem to have, in fits and starts over the last two years, come upon something which answers more questions than anything before. At the same time, it does something much more important than simply answering questions...it actually feels correct. Not forced. Not almost a good fit, which I might be able to squeeze my spirituality into if I hold my breath just right. This time, I may have found the thing that is right, because it is telling me a story I already knew.

I have discovered...or more correctly...recognized the stories and "myths" of Gnosticism, to be those I've known as far back as my limited memory allows me to recall...maybe even a little further. From their belief that all is not right in the world and beyond, to the more personally accurate story of creation, "salvation" and beyond. Even to the very purpose and reason for our existence and that of the universes. It's less a recent discovery than it is a recalled memory.

I found a little Gnosis...and I feel fine. ;)

The Frothy Sea of the Cosmos Theory

"Imagine if you will a dimension not of sight, or sound, or time, but of mind."

That phrase is the famous opening words of the Twilight Zone. It's catchy. It's quirky, and it just might be the most insightful tagline ever on TV. Now I know it wasn't up against much competition on the idiot box, so that may not be saying much. The idea behind the phrase though...oh that idea...that idea is most definitely saying a lot...a lot of cosmic proportions.

Let's do what we were asked to do for just a moment.

Imagine a dimension. This dimension is not one of a physical world, so sight, sound, even time, have no real meaning here. It's a dimension where anything is possible and everything is. There are no stars here. No planets. No trees. No people. No molecules or even atoms. In fact, in this dimension there is only an infinite, eternal, swirling, undulating foam. A sea if you will. A frothy sea, but it doesn't stretch out with a flat surface like the seas you're used to. It doesn't even stretch out in three dimensions, but it is never ending. It is everywhere. It is everything...and everything is it.

I know, that's already getting confusing. That's ok though. In fact, it's expected, because we aren't just imagining any old dimension here. We aren't even REALLY imagining a dimension at all. What we are imagining is much more than just a dimension. Much more than a mere level or form of existence. What we are seeing in our mind, is in fact the ONLY dimension. The only true existence on any level, in any way, in any form. What we are seeing in our minds...is Reality.

But hold on a minute...dont go trying to wrap your thoughts around that just yet.

Reality. The only true existence. The only thing that is...the all that is...ever will be...ever was...this reality. The every day world of solid matter and Newtonian Physics. The atoms, electrons, and sub-atomic particles of Quantum Physics. The cosmic strings, black holes, and 10 dimensions of String Theory. The angels, demons, heaven, hell, and God of monotheistic religions. The gods and goddesses, elementals, and magical energies of paganistic religions. The aura, karma, and mystical cosmic energies of new age and eastern religions. Philosophies. Dreams. Everything you think you know and everything you don't know you don't. They are all part of this Reality. This reality that truly exists in only one place...your mind.

--- more to come ---

Comments from MySpace

	SoulSentinal	I hope there is more to come. At this point it appears you have not even got the tip of the iceberg yet. Quote: "Reality. The only true existence. The only thing that is...the all that is...ever will be...ever was...this reality." This reality in my opinion is is unphathomable. -- This Comment was Edited for being WAY too damned long ;) -- Posted by SoulSentinal on Wednesday, June 07, 2006 at 10:59 PM
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	FitterHappier	Well, finally my turn to post a comment! That other one just kept going and going and going...... Is that proper blog etiqutte? I mean, come on if you have that much crap to post, put it on your blog. Geez! Anyway...... Chris, so are you saying that you know everything you know so therefore you know everything? Or could it be that because of everything that you don't know, you know nothing. So deep........ Posted by FitterHappier on Thursday, June 08, 2006 at 9:56 PM
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	monkeybrains803	Naturally I'm saying, "I know everything I know, therefore I know everything". That's been my tagline since I was like five. But of course...I guess it would be more accurate to say, I know nothing, therefore I know everything. Because really...to say I know everything, would mean I really know nothing. Which then of course, I'm simply saying that I know everything I know, so therefore I know everything...which is true in a strict sense. For something to exist to me I have to know it...at least at some level...even if I'm not aware of it. So if everything that exist to me is something I know, then you could rightly say, that I know everything I know, therefore I know everything. See? That makes sense doesn't it? hehe Posted by monkeybrains803 on Wednesday, June 14, 2006 at 3:27 PM
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	The Ultimate Awesome	so i think youre saying that all reality comes from our mind...but then that makes me wonder like how do we know what comes from our mind is real... when i dream, if i get hurt in that dream i wake up to find that im not hurt at all...so then...what was my dream? to most people the dream i had wasnt reality because what happened in the dream did not continue after i woke up...but yet a dream comes from my mind, so it must be reality i wonder if there are different types of dimensions...reality being what we live in everyday consciously...and non-reality being our dreams and things we cannot see or possibly detect, but exist i saw a little bit about the string theory on GPBS or whatever that station is called and the part that interested me most was the matrix theory...the matrix theory predicts that there are 11 Dimensions sorry to quote wiki but :) "Matrix Theory M-theory predicts the existence of eleven dimensions. One of these known dimensions is time. This dimension does not relate to space in the same way as do the other three known dimensions, length, depth and height. This leads to the hypothesis that the other seven less known dimensions could be related to the known four dimensions in other non-spatial ways also. Previously, string theorists suggested that these other seven dimensions were tightly compressed to account for the way they are not observable within space. But using time as an analogy allows us to perceive that these other dimensions could be powerful expansive dimensions that are woven to the physical fabric or matrix of the universe in other unseen ways" im sure those things wont matter much to us in the long run...but you never know...im a big fan of weird stuff happening :) i dont know if i sound stupid or not lol...i mean, i did make a D+ in physics..i suck at science Posted by The Ultimate Awesome on Wednesday, June 14, 2006 at 2:43 PM
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	monkeybrains803	Doesn't sound stupid to me! Of course I did make a D in Physics myself. But that wasn't my fault. Like I told Mrs. Stuabbs over and over, "I like the theory, but the math just isn't right. You can't expect me to be able to do math that is just wrong." I kicked butt on the theory. Knew it before she ever had a chance to explain it, but the math. Well...it was just flawed. Not much I could do about that. Now dreams, I think they could be exactly what you're saying there. They could also be windows on another dimension, they could be memories accessed from some place we've stored them out in the cosmos. Or they could even be something as odd as mini-cosmos created spontaneously in our minds as we sleep that pop into existence and then fade away as we wake. When it comes right down to it, even though others may not usually experience them with us, the fact that they exist in our mind technically makes them just as real as the shared reality of experience we have in our normal physical plane of existence. I like dreams. There is nothing cooler than learning to control your dreams. Waking up inside a dream and being able to bend it to your will...that's probably about as close to god-like as most of us will ever get in this stage of existence. Lucid Dreaming is what it's called and if you've never done it...you have to try it. If you like the Matrix Theory, you might want to read the books "Elegant Universe" or "The Holographic Theory of the Universe". Also you might want to watch this, but it's like an hour and half long and you really need to watch it when you won't be interupted or bothered. I can't say all of it works for me, but it's awful close to my view of things in a lot of ways. Posted by monkeybrains803 on Wednesday, June 14, 2006 at 3:22 PM
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	monkeybrains803	Well...it looks like Google got smart and removed that video. I'll have to see if I can track down another copy of it. Sorry. Posted by monkeybrains803 on Wednesday, June 14, 2006 at 3:29 PM
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	FitterHappier	My Theory My theory on time is..... well, a little difficult to explain. I believe that time is not made up in layers (imagine building a wall with legos) where one layer is put down and then another on top of it, and then another. I believe that time is more like a combination of a huge rubberband and a never ending ball of yarn. The rubberband does not have a begining or an end, but it is one continuous loop. It can stretch and shorten, twist, and overlap itself to suit its present use. Now imagine this huge rubberband being wrapped up like a ball of yarn, no specific pattern, just around and around and around...overlapping itself in random places each time it goes around. This is how I believe that seeing a ghost (or spirit or whatever you wish to call it) is possible. If I'm in 2006, and this ghost is from 1914 then how can we be in the same place at the same time? Because my place on the rubberband and his place on the rubberband have overlapped. Sometimes this may last for awhile, and sometimes it may only last a second or two, as the different places slide past each other as the band is being twisted. But who twists and stretches the band? That's where religion comes in....... and that's when this simple theory gets a bit complicated. I guess, now I have to follow in shadoe & monkey's footsteps and post more about it on my blog! Posted by FitterHappier on Sunday, June 18, 2006 at 11:13 AM
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	The Ultimate Awesome	that idea is cool, it's crossed my mind b4 too but i never looked into it anymore than that Posted by The Ultimate Awesome on Monday, June 19, 2006 at 1:21 PM
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FitterHappier

On Dreams... Dreams are indeed a part of reality, just as a fictional TV show is. Even though they are not a physical thing that you can hold and move and touch, they are still relevant to reality. As we've discussed above, not all of reality is a concrete thing that you can see or touch. Anything that you or I or the billions of other people in the world have ever thought or ever will think becomes a part of reality. Now back to the dreams: Just because it hasn't happened in the present, doesn't mean that it didn't happen in the past, or won't happen in the future. If you believe in reincarnation (and I do), then couldn't dreams be a way to look into your soul's past or even a preview into the future? Could they serve as a warning of actions and consequences in this life? Here's the "BIG ONE"... Or because they don't take place in this dimension (plane or whatever) could they be a way for us to think and do in a totally different way than is possible when we're awake? Does this mean that all of life's mysteries could be answered in our dreams? Maybe. The important thing to remember when discussing these type of things is, to think about it for yourself. Believe what YOU believe. Be opened minded and if you get "stumped" on a particular part, ask someone. There are plenty of people out there that are willing to share their ideas. Above all, trust your gut feeling and never be afraid to "call bullshit" (in your own mind, so as not to be rude) when you just don't think that something you're hearing is right for you. Posted by FitterHappier on Sunday, June 18, 2006 at 11:52 AM

Number One Selling Christian Christmas Gift for 2006 is here!!

Mark Morford, the near-god like editorialist from San Francisco, has done it again. Thats right kiddies! This time he has found what is sure to be the number one must have gift under the tree for this years Christmas give-fests.

"Left Behind: Eternal Forces" the real-time strategy shoot'em up from the good people at Left Behind Games, Inc.

Take hold of God's mighty weapon of wrath and destruction...the M-9 sub-machine gun. Rip the non-believers a few new prayer holes...its ok God said so. So bash a few skulls, blow off some arms and pray someone right into the grave. All in the name of the one true bad-ass God.

You can even switch sides and take on the Christians as a member of the Anti-Christ's Global Community Peacekeepers. Oh yeah baby thats the stuff! Nothing tougher and more lethal than those U.N. rough necks in the big baby blue helmets! I know how I'm gonna be spending my Sunday mornings around Christmas time.

You have got to check this thing out. Just make sure you aren't drinking Coke at the time...that stuff burns when it comes out your nose.

Jesus Loves Machine Guns (Mark Morford):
http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/gate/archive/2006/06/07/notes060706.DTL&nl=fix

Can Christian Video Games Compete? (ABC News):
http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=1958823

Left Behind Games:
http://www.leftbehindgames.com/pages/index.html

Comments from MySpace

	FitterHappier	What do you expect from the people who started the crusades? Still a funny story though. Posted by FitterHappier on Thursday, June 08, 2006 at 9:42 PM

G-CHILD

Buwhuahahahaha!!! I couldn've said it btr myself!!! Freaking tards!!! LOL!!! Posted by G-CHILD on Tuesday, July 18, 2006 at 3:53 PM

Happy Egg and Zombie Day!!

Here’s some funny for the weekend’s holiday!

Pagan Manners in Christian Church

I am a member of Ár nDraíocht Féin: A Druid Fellowship (ADF). One of the great benefits of being part of an organizatoin like ADF are the group’s mailing lists. ADF has many great lists. I am currently subscribed to 10 of them. That’s probaby like five too many because I can never really keep up with it all. However, the information and participation I do get from them is a huge help to me day to day.

One recent descussion we’ve been having on one of the lists, is how to approch the attendance of Christian churches during the holidays. It’s inevitable that most of us will be invited by some well meaning, or sinisterly diabolical, family member. Since most of us want to TRY to be part of the family, even if they don’t always want to claim us, it’s nice to have some idea how to act. The following eMail from ADF member “Bren” seems very helpful in that area, so he gave permission to republish. Enjoy!

With the holiday season upon us, a reoccurring question for me is now at the forefront: how exactly should a neo-pagan such as myself behave when going to a Christian church? To me, this is a time to be with family and participate to the extent possible in family activities, and that often includes going to some kind of church service at some point or another.

I’ve always tried to be polite and respectful. There are some clear and easy rules based on that respect that boil down to: don’t make a scene. But there are some points which I have been ambivalent about, and have handled in different ways in the past. For example, how should one behave during congregational parts such as reciting Creeds out loud or singing hymns?

After some dialogue I recently had with the fine folks at “Oh How I Love Jesus” on this topic, I came up with the following guidelines based on my hard-polytheistic world-view:
* A church is the “House of God,” therefore, rules of basic hospitality apply. We should be respectful then, not only of our family and members of the congregation, but of the deities involved: Jesus and Yaweh (and possibly others: The Holy Spirit, Mary, various saints, etc.)
* We should dress appropriately, in “Sunday Best” or whatever mode of dress is expected.
* No overt pagan symbols. I would go so far as to say that we should not even bring any pagan symbology or tools. If, for some reason, you have to have something with you, I suggest it be “peace-bonded.” That is, it should be tied up or encumbered in such a way as to be clear that it cannot be easily accessed, and also stored out of sight so as not to invite questions. When we are in the home of Christian deities, it is in a spirit of “truce” and at least temporary peace no matter what our feelings may be, and we should bend to their preferences to the extent it is reasonable and possible to do so.
* We should not participate in communion. Receiving the blessings of their god should be left to his followers.
* We should generally speak only truthful words. Any kind of participatory speaking should be limited to saying things you actually believe in. A respectful silence should be maintained at other times.
* We should not discuss our beliefs or mention other gods. It is clear that theirs is a jealous God, and would not want such discussion in His home.
* We should give money when an offering plate is passed. As guests, especially somewhat unwelcome ones, hospitality requires that we bring a gift for our host. The congregation might not want offerings from Pagans, but it is none of their business. Since we shouldn’t discuss this matter, they have no reason to even know. Offerings are made to the God(s), and concerns a matter between him/them and us alone.
* We should not make prayers to our deities, not even silently.
Presumably, if our gods can hear our silent, unspoken prayers, then of course He can too, and it would be rude. We should wait until we are on our own ground and our own time to revere our gods.
* We should sit or stand with the congregation as they do. With a congregation that kneels, I would suggest remaining seated. Kneeling is more than respect, it is a sign of obeisance, which would be inappropriate.
Bowing is not inappropriate, and so I feel bowing our heads during their prayers as requested is properly respectful.
* I have been to churches where it is routine for them to ask rudely personal questions such as: ‘do you have Jesus in your heart?’ I admit, I have always lied and said, ‘yes.’ Since this is an intimately private matter, I believe it is permissible to lie to protect my privacy. Any answer, as long as it is polite, would be appropriate, but in a congregation that would ask such a question, a truthful answer is just inviting trouble.

I invite comments on this article, as this is an issue I continue to struggle with ­ this list being just a snapshot of where I am with it right now. I might amend this list as new thoughts and ways of looking at the issue are presented to me.

I am that I am

I’ve been having dreams again. Well I always have dreams, but I’ve been having particular dreams again.

Lately, I am being accosted by all sorts of beings in my dreams. They are in fact really starting to annoy me with the crap. Obviously, they have something important to tell me, but I mean damn, do they REALLY have to beat me over the head with it. I’ve had to take to using “my words” on them again. Controlling them with “my words” seems to be about the only thing that will work. I’m pretty decent at lucid dreaming, but these “people” just don’t want to play along unless I make them.

Besides the aggressive nature of my would-be messengers is the fact they don’t seem to be able to come right out and say anything. Whatever messages they might have are totally wrapped up in a riddle of some sort.

So I sit each morning in front of my computer at work and try to decipher them…it’s not like I have anything else to do.

After much thought and deliberation, I have come to one clear conclusion.

They are trying to tell me to get my head out of my ass.

I want to be pagan. Hell I am pagan. I really always have been. I know it. The cosmos knows it. Apparently, many many beings know it. So why the heck am I fighting it!? Well, that I’m still unsure of. It’s likely a tinge of Christian programming which still makes me feel slightly guilty about the whole thing. But you know what…I am what I am. If what I am is pagan, then so be it. It’s not like the Christian god wants to talk to me anymore anyway. All we’ve ever done is argue. And hey…if he ever wants to make up…he knows where to find me. Right?

So from here on out, I am pagan. Hopefully it doesn’t put my grand-parents in the grave, but I refuse to continue to deny myself simple because others may not like it.

Chris: “Hello. Hi. My name is Chris and I’m a pagan.”
Chorus of the Cosmos: “Welcome Chris.”
Chris: “So umm…where are the refreshments? I was told there’d be refreshments.”

Christian Exodus

“ChristianExodus.org is orchestrating the move of thousands of Christians to reacquire our Constitutional rights and, if necessary to attain these rights, dissolve our State’s bond with the union.”

Maybe you need to re-read that…I know I did the first time I came across it. This is an actual organization led by some guy from California named Cory Burnell. They just had their first annual meeting in Greenville, SC, over this past weekend.

This is a group of Christians who have taken it upon themselves to relocate to MY state, take over MY state’s government, and then, as they say, if necessary to meet their goals, secede from the union.

OK, admittedly, anyone who knows me knows I have issues with this state I live in. South Carolina is about as backward as they come in many areas. However, I have the right to work to change the state more to my liking because it’s MY state.

These guys are openly admitting that their plan is to move in outsiders in such numbers that they will be able to co-op the local, county and state government positions through election. At that point they will began passing their own laws and changing those they don’t like.

I can only say two things to this: 1) They obviously have no clue how independent we Southerners are, or how much we detest outsiders trying to manipulate us. 2) Umm…I’m pretty sure a group of people has already tried this whole secession thing once…and if I remember my history right…it didn’t work out so well for them.

You will definitely be hearing more from me on this in the near future. Take some time to check these people out though. There is an active discussion on them over at WitchVox.

These Exodus guys are a scary bunch…course not nearly as scary as I’m going to be if one of them tries to tell me *I* don’t have the right to believe and think how I want to in “THEIR” state.

Don’t make me angry Mr. Burnell…you wouldn’t like me when I’m angry.

It’s not a tree…it’s an idea.

It’s not a tree…it’s an idea.

A quote about druidism: "Druidry is not a religion. It’s a philosophy and you can worship a God or a Goddess, it’s up to you. You can be a Christian or a Moslem or anything else and still be a Druid. "But while a Christian will say God made that tree, a Druid will say the energy of a creative force is in that tree." Kieron, a North-East UK Druid.

Druidism is about as close to my personal philosophy as anything I’ve seen. That being the case, I’ve dedicated much of my free time toward the study of druidism as both a philosophy and potential religion.

My personal focus is on Druidry that follows a Celtic path. My ancestral origins are about equal Celtic and Native American, but I lean toward my Celtic heritage simply because it is more accessible.

Through such organizations as Ár nDraíocht Féin: A Druid Fellowship, or ADF, I’ve begun in the last few months to explore the Indo-European origins of the Celtic way and wisdom of this ancient people.

I’m currently reading:

• The Druids by Peter Berresford Ellis
• The Wisdom of The Celts by Patricia King
• Irish Fairy and Folktales by W.B. Yeats
• Complete Idiot’s Guide to: Celtic Wisdom by Carl McColman

I’ll be writing more on my studies and journey…hopefully at least once a week. In the mean time, if you’d like more information on druidism in general, please check out it’s entry at Religious Tolerance.org.

…or, just ask the funny looking guy in your local city park rubbing two rocks together, while sharing tea and conversation with his bestest buddy…Mr. Oak.